I met Yiftah at a hostel in Dunedin on the South Island of New Zealand. He is in his mid-20s and was traveling after serving three years in the Israeli Defense Forces.
FASOTE: What are your thoughts on the political or spiritual state of the United States of America?
YIFTAH: I think the United States at the moment is sort of overdoing its self, in terms of trying to control the world. It is right about having to fight terrorism - the idea of it is right, but the way they are doing it I don't agree with. I think they are going too much for good public opinion - just sort of cowardly fighting from the air, and not really going into the points or special small places that they need to go in to. The way they are doing it, they are hurting civilians and in turn creating more hatred. The concept is right - you should fight terror, and you should guard your homes. 9/11 proved that, and the situation that I live in in Israel proves that - we are having to fight it all the time. You cannot give in to it.
FASOTE: So how does the war in Iraq have anything to do with the War on Terrorism?
YIFTAH: Saddam Hussein is one of the people that represents terrorism - he is a terrorist himself. The way he's controlling his country is terrorism. And, one of the things I know for a fact is that he is sponsoring terrorists with his own money - terrorists who perform terrible acts inside of Israel. He actually promises money - I think it is about 1500 US dollars or something like that - to every Palestinian family who produces a suicide bomber that kills Israelis. He is not controlling his own country legitimately - I don't think his own people want him - and I think that makes him a terrorist as well. He is hurting both sides, and he should be taken care of.
FASOTE: How do you define terrorism?
YIFTAH: I think the definition of terrorism is when you deliberately hurt civilians to try and change a political status. If I am not mistaken that is the U.N.'s definition. Now, of course, there are two sides to everything and you can always say that someone is a freedom fighter, but you have to go look at the surrounding factors and at history. Of course you can say that America is trying to influence those countries too much with its economy, but I think if you are doing it through economic means then it is still fair play because those countries are still very rich and they can play back. But once you start bombing civilian places inside a country, that is terror. I don't have any reason to be afraid to hop on a bus back home just because someone on the other side thinks it is the right way.
FASOTE: So, terrorism is the targeting of civilians, right? Even though civilians die in Israeli and U.S. attacks, it is not terrorism because they are not being targeted?
YIFTAH: Of course, there is no black and white - there is always a grey area. In a war, people get killed - there is nothing you can do about it. Everyone has a chance to get hurt. But to say that what we do or what America does is a terror act - no. A terror act is what started all this - blowing up those buildings in New York. A terror act is what we are seeing around Israel - people living their own normal lives and someone else coming in and taking that life away. We saw that in New York, and we see that in my home. Of course, after these things happen you have to defend yourself and go with your armies, and that is not terrorism, that is war.
FASOTE: Palestinians say that they have no other option - they are unhappy with their political situation, but if they met Israel on the battlefield they would get slaughtered. They say it is not terrorism, but just their most effective form of armed struggle. What do you say to that?
YIFTAH: First of all, the way the Palestinians fight - it is just a game. They are actually cards in the hands of people like Saddam Hussein or any of the leaders in Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Iran - all those. What they are doing is using the state of the Palestinians as political cards to be played against Israel, for the reason of giving a common enemy to their own people so that they will be easier to control. They pay certain leaders of the Palestinians, like Arafat at the moment, to give them the ability to play these cards. If they weren't doing this, then the Palestinians would have alternate ways to attack their problem. If you look at the way Israel has been handling them over the last few years, especially during the time of Ehud Barak - I'm not saying I am for him or against him, but he did try everything. He gave the Palestinians all the healthcare for free, all the police force, lots of funds for building projects, industrial zones - everything they would need to establish a country. But, because the other Arab countries did not want this, no deal was reached and now we are back to violence, which is exactly what those other countries want. But their violence will not change us in any way. I'm not going to give up my home because of that, so what they are doing is useless.
FASOTE: What do you think of the Islamic world today?
YIFTAH: The Islamic world is badly divided into two parts - there is the Far East, which has Malaysia and countries like that, which are a bit more laid back and live normal sort of lives. Then there is the Arabian part, which has too many people who have let themselves be controlled by fundamentalists who pull them in to wars and things that normal people shouldn't be doing. I think it is their fault - every one of the Arab people's fault, because they didn't fight. If you look at Europe, they used to have many dictatorships, but every one of them was knocked down, and now all of the Europeans live a free life. I don't see that happening with the Arabian Muslims - you only see it the other way, like with Iran, which used to be nice and liberal and very Western but was turned the other way around and now is one of the most fundamentalist countries there is.
FASOTE: But, one could argue that what is good for Europe is necessarily good for the Arabs. Yes, Iran was liberal and Western, but it was also extremely repressive and all the wealth was controlled by a tiny minority at the top. That revolution happened because most people were upset - revolutions only succeed if the masses join in, right? That was a natural revolution of the people.
YIFTAH: I think if you go into most Arabian countries today and look at the state of the people, you would find that the differences between the rich and the poor are just awful. You can go to a place like Iraq, which has a small layer of leaders that are so rich that they can't even spend all their money, but just a small distance from their houses there are people dying of starvation. Look at Saudi Arabia - it is like that. In Syria the situation is especially serious. So, this revolution didn't actually bring any good changes for the people - I don't think those people are any happier living like that.
FASOTE: But Iran is the only place that had the revolution, and you could argue that their standard of living hasn't increased because they have been under economic sanctions for 20 years. They aren't allowed to use their vast oil wealth like the other countries are. I guess my main point is - I agree with you that the Islamic world needs change, but what if change comes in the form of something that you don't like?
YIFTAH: It is hard for me to accept that this type of revolution would be effective. Over the years, we have seen in history places that tried communism or dictatorships fail. Mankind is built to be competitive, but he is also built for freedom. This is what I am saying - the world is controlled by democratic means, and I think that is the only way a country can really function well today.
FASOTE: Do you think that the Islamic world and the Western world can ever live together in harmony?
YIFTAH: I think if you look at the Western world, and you look at where it started about 400 years back, you will see that it was somewhat similar to where the Islamic world is today. There was actually a time when the Islamic world was very strong - Muslims are the ones who invented the zero, they are the ones who brought geometry to the world. But at some point, the fundamentalists took over and stopped this - it happened to the Christians too in the 1400s, but they were able to pull themselves out of it. It took a couple of hundred years, but they were able to leave that situation and to let themselves develop. In the Muslim world, it seems that they have left progress behind and have just deteriorated more and more. I hope that one day - not in my lifetime but maybe in my grandchildren's lifetime - that you will see them getting back up, that you will see them fighting those fundamentalist leaders and getting to a situation where people can live normal lives without worrying about their desperate economic situation.
FASOTE: So, after sweeping reform in the Islamic world, the two sides will be able to live together?
YIFTAH: Hypothetically yes, but honestly, at the moment it seems like a very apocalyptic situation. I'm sorry to say that, but at the moment I can' see it happening. It seems like more and more Arab countries are retreating - they are going backwards. Maybe if the place was somehow more open to Western civilization - things like radio or television, just so people could see and decide for themselves. You can see, in places like Hong Kong, that they are open to Western influences and can decide for themselves if they want to be a part of it. The Arabs just don't know - they don't have the opportunity to decide.
FASOTE: OK - do you think that the U.S.A.'s War on Terrorism will help or hurt humanity?
YIFTAH: Well, the way it is going right now I think it is going to hurt - it will not help anything. The right people aren't getting killed - mostly civilians, and that will lead to more people hating America and more people becoming like the Taliban. Instead of dealing straight with the people they need to deal with, the Americans are giving more people to their enemies. In dealing with a situation like terrorism, you have to first take the wrong people out of control positions, and then you need to bring education to the rest of the people. America is only fighting with bombs right now, and not with education - this, in the end, will hurt them more than help them.
FASOTE: I like to try and end on a positive note. What is the best thing about Israel?
YIFTAH: The people. Israelis are very diverse - we have many religions, and in each religion there are people from everywhere. So, we have Jewish people from all over the world, we have Muslims from all over the world, we have Christians from all over the world - there is so much diversity that it is really interesting. And, being in the hard situation that we have been in for all these years, it has made the people very sharp as well. It is very interesting to talk to people, to listen to their opinions. That is what makes it, for me, the best place to live.
FASOTE: Do you have any heroes, or people that you look up to?
YIFTAH: I think the world today is lacking in heroes. I think the people that I was raised to look up to now seem a bit too capitalistic in my eyes. People like Bill Gates - he is a success, but he is not someone to look up too. We used to have some political leaders like that - people you could admire, but not now. I think Sharon is getting there, but he still needs to do a bit more before I can put him in that category.
FASOTE: Anything else to add?
YIFTAH: Well, it has been said before, but knowledge is power. You gotta learn, you gotta leave your country, you gotta meet people - it is the only way too really learn things. I used to live in the States - I've seen how people are talked to over there. You got a lot of black and whites - not enough greys. And people there accept it because they don't leave the country. Once you a travel a bit, you begin to see that most of the world is grey, and that is something that you have to understand before you can really know the world.
FASOTE: Thank you for your time.
