Teman Negara is a 130 million year old rainforest on the central Malaysian peninsula. The Malaysian government promotes the region as a tourist destination, and G-Bang and his family run Nusa Camp, a jungle camp complete with private cabins and dorms. We spoke on February 5th, 2002 in the camp's restaurant.
FASOTE: How do you define terrorism?
GBANG: For me it is difficult to define terrorism. You must look first at what people are trying to do - they are doing it for profit. Or they are doing it because they are pushed to do it, for their own freedom. To me, terrorism is an act that is really brutal to another living thing - not people who fight for their own freedom, for their own land.
FASOTE: What do you feel is the state of the Islamic world?
GBANG: I think we need both spiritual and political leaders. We need to unite and be strong - control our own economies. It is not about armies - we don't need that, we don't need to attack anyone. We must defend ourselves, but we need power only to deal with the world in a peaceful way.
FASOTE: Do you think we'll see this happen in our lifetimes?
GBANG: I'm not sure. Not until one of the most powerful Muslim countries is gone and not until Palestine is its own country. I think a lot of the rich Muslim countries, as long as they still have money, they will not open their eyes. Not until one of them collapses. If you look at one of the most powerful Muslim countries like Saudi Arabia - why do they not help poor countries like Pakistan? I think we have a few third world organizations that try to bring these third world countries - and I don't know where the term "third world" country came from - together, but they don't really work.
FASOTE: You mean like the OIC (Organization of the Islamic Conference)?
GBANG: Yeah - you know why they are called that? Because, when something happens, they get together and say 'Oh, I see' (laughter).
FASOTE: OK - what do you feel is that spiritual or political state of America today?
GBANG: I don't know. It seems like stupid propaganda - like some stupid conspiracy. They talk about trying to make the world a better place and make it more peaceful. But, all you hear all the time is war war war. Everyone everywhere talks about war - there is no peace. I think all the big countries want to close the small countries - finish them, take them over.
FASOTE: Why would they want that?
GBANG: I don't know - maybe to make it easier. To have everything in your hand.
FASOTE: Do you believe the War on Terrorism will help or hurt humanity?
GBANG: It won't finish, it won't end. Because - what they classify as terrorists are people who fight for their own freedom. If they bomb the Iraqis, they will fight for their freedom and then be called terrorists. Just like they call the Palestinians terrorists - what does that make the Israelis? It's not fair.
FASOTE: Do you think that Islam and the West can co-exist?
FASOTE: I think it is like a puppet show. I think you see things moving and talking, but that is not the real thing. It is being moved and talked by other people. It is the same with Muslims and Westerners. We can see that sometimes both sides say there is no fight with the other, but the truth is that there is. Because, both sides just don't understand each other. The Westerners don't have a clear mind of what to do about Muslims - they have a prejudice. All around the world, where there are problems between Muslims and other religions, they always take the other side. Look at what happened in India, Palestine, Bosnia - the Muslims can do nothing. They are so much weaker - they cannot fight on equal terms so they die. So, I do not think that we can't co-exist, but we must try to understand each other better. And right now, there is not really any profit for the West to understand us better, so they won't.
FASOTE: What is your definition of freedom?
GBANG: I think you are not supposed to have freedom. If we have freedom, there would be no religion, no law, no Prime minister, no president - nothing. That is freedom, and it would not lead you anywhere because you wouldn't know what was right and what was wrong. Because - I could kill you - that's freedom, right? People need rules for living - that's what religion is all about.
FASOTE: What is the best thing about Malaysia?
GBANG: Well - before, I lived for three years in England. And when I was there, I remember thinking - Wow, I am so lucky to be here! But, when I come back to Malaysia, I feel really lucky - it is so beautiful, so peaceful. We live in harmony here - many races and cultures, and I really enjoy that.
FASOTE: Thanks for your time.
